Florida, Sign Petition to Secede Here!

This is on the official White House web page.  I understand that the most likely outcome is nothing will happen, but you can be sure that NOT signing will result in nothing happening except Obama believing he has a mandate for socialism:

Peacefully grant the State of Florida to withdraw from the United States of America and create its own NEW government.

On the other hand, if enough people sign, then maybe our State leaders will get the message, grow a spine and some “Joe Bidens” and move to save what is left of America by actually acting on this threat — before we have another civil war.

15 States including Texas have filed a petition to secede from the United States

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88 thoughts on “Florida, Sign Petition to Secede Here!

  1. Oh, dear. It seems I already have an account there, but I can’t remember the password. Mr. Kells does not like that I get crafty with these passwords. He also gets upset that I don’t put them into this Black Hole thingy. I’m always so sure I’ll remember them…..and now this. You boys will all keep your pieholes shut about this. The site is to e-mail my password. Uh-huh.

  2. The Examiner headline is inaccurate, of course. Residents of 15 states, not the states themselves, have filed petitions for secession.

    So far they’re not getting as many signatures as the pro-marijuana folks, but I wish them luck. It seems an odd approach, though: If folks were actually serious about doing anything other than expressing dissatisfaction with Obama (which they just did in greater numbers by voting against him), I think they’d have more success in persuading their state legislatures to more toward succession rather than thinking that the feds will magically grant it based on the signatures of a percentage of folks within a state.

    • Logan Sweetie you are the IDIOT. You have no clue where this President is going to take this country. If you think you are going to get a free ride on everything think again. Our Rights are going to be striped from us little by little. If you Like Communism that is what you are going to get. I sure would like to here your opinion when Obamacare kicks in and they tell you sorry you cant have that operation or deny you medication and dont think they cant. If Obamacare is so good why isnt the Senate & Congress going to use it???? Logan use the brain you were born with and look for yourself and read. This president has proven that he lies and then try to blame someone else. Look forward to hearing from you in 4 years.

      • Melly, exactly. That’s just your standard liberal hyperbole. They think they won something fantastic by a landslide. Truth be told, we still have the same President, same Senate, and same House.

        We did gain a few conservative governors, but that really is the extent of the change.

        Four more years of the same ole, same ole. Yeah, how’s that a landslide for you liberals? At least you still got your hope, because you have yet to get your change.

      • An electoral one:
        338 vs 203 or a difference of 24 percentage points:
        (or 27 more than the landslide victory George will predicted for Romney)

        George Will outlined a huge Romney Election Day in an interview on ABC’s “This Week,” predicting a 321-217 landslide that included nearly every swing state including Minnesota.

        A landslide election is an election in which one candidate wins by a substantial margin. The precise definition of a landslide election varies, with some people saying that the margin needs to consist of five points or more, setting a relatively low bar, while others say that the margin should be much higher, closer to 10 or 15 points. If a candidate achieves a landslide victory, it suggests a strong mandate from the people.

        • CCF,

          Do you realize that a 330,000 vote reversal in 4 swing States and Romney wins by almost the same margin? In a nation of more than 300 million people, we are talking about 1% of the vote. You call that a landslide? Or are you just that ignorant about the issues we’re discussing?

          • No, he’s not ignorant at all. I could forgive him his ignorance, if that were the case. He’s simply dishonest.

            If you notice his post, it’s all about his idol, and not actually how the distribution of power that obviously has not changed.

            • Augger,

              I know. Frankly, I’m not sure why any of us are trying to “convince” anyone of anything anymore. If you haven’t chosen sides, you are with the Left. At this point in time, it is time to consider a peaceful version of the Jefferson/Tree of Liberty option.

    • Talk about the pot calling the kettle black. I’m afraid it is you sir who is the idiot. A vote as close as this one was cannot be called a landslide by any means. So If you believe what you said, you have just exibited your intelligence to all.

    • His victory was by no measure a “landslide,” and we have every right to express our disgust and distaste for the outcome.

  3. The Examiner headline is inaccurate, of course. Residents of 15 states, not the states themselves, have filed petitions for secession.

    This comment betrays the accepted belief that this nation is not, nor are the States republics. This is exactly the mentality to which I try to draw your attention. I belies the founding principles and ideals of this nation: that THE PEOPLE are sovereign — not the governments they set up to do their bidding.

    • Joe, the people may indeed be sovereign. But it’s those people–not the states–who are signing the petitions, right?

      • James,

        What’s the difference? If we accept the polls, then they called the election result accurately, but those same polls tell us the mod of the nation is not as far Left as the Democrats are claiming — and that is without any adjustment for the systematic cheating that occurred. So, if the federal and State governments are not going to respond to the true will of the people, they have the right to go the same route as our founders.

        true, they may not succeed, but it is their right none the less. But equally as telling as your apparent assumption that the federal and State governments are sovereign and not the people is the implicit implication that democracy trumps the rights of the minority. This betrays another fundamental break in your beliefs about this nation and the ideals upon which it was founded. Our founders explicitly rejected democracy as the tyranny of the majority, and we are reaping the result of the Progressive efforts to render the republican protections asunder.

        Today, too many Americans believe as you appear to believe: that might makes right and the minority deserves to be plundered and enslaved.

        • Joe,
          James does not believe in Democracy. The will of “the people” being followed.

          James believes the “Government” is the sovereign, and is quite content with the Sovereign’s intent on retaining CONTROL over “The People”.

          If James clearly held Democracy in esteem, James would be Standing SIDE BY SIDE WITH US, DEMANDING ALL INACCURATE VOTING IRREGULARITIES BE OPENLY AND HONESTLY INVESTIGATED so that DEMOCRACY, the WILL of the PEOPLE would be followed.

          Winning through LIES, Intimidation, & FORCE, is NOT winning the hearts and minds of “the people”. They understand they cannot win as subjugation is Death, and a majority will shortly understand ALL too QUICKLY.

          STATISTS CANNOT win on the TRUE, EVEN battlefield of IDEAS and PRINCIPLES. SO, the STATISTS will FORCE their WILL upon ALL Americans.

        • I think that the petitions are primarily to create attention to the the situation, and if that doesn’t work, the proper avenue to take is to address our own state legislatures and demand that our state enact the nullification provisions of the Constitution. Thereby desstroying the federal governments (BHO) attack on our liberties and freedoms. This is a more accessible means to the public than any other. GOD Bless America

  4. Joe: “Our founders explicitly rejected democracy as the tyranny of the majority.”

    Texas: “If James clearly held Democracy in esteem, James would be Standing SIDE BY SIDE WITH US.”

    You two are funny. How about if I just sit back and let you guys argue this one out? Extraneous capital letters optional, of course.

    • No contradiction whatsoever, James. The tyranny of the majority and corrupt elections are both tools of the Democrat party, have been since the days of slavery.

      • Romney conceeded, last i heard, and a good thing because he got landslided out of the park. Gore won his election but the Conservative Supreme Court appointed our first Dictator who abidicated his throne 4 years ago after destroying the kingdom.

        I was referring to the seceeders from the union who feel their “minority” rights are being trampled because they didn’t get a candidate the minority voted for. That’s more than a little nutty. If you guys were really worried about minority rights you would have done something for my man, Ron Paul at your convention instead of inviting him there and then sitting him a corner. No one puts the baby doctor in a corner! Well except Romney i guess.

        If only he had a Patrick Swayzee to pull him out so he could perform his anti-fed song and dance.

  5. Will Obama use NDAA To Arrest State Representatives and State Militias that support Secession?

    Could Obama use NDAA To Arrest Secessionists on the Premise members are Militants and Belligerents that pose a threat to National Security?

    Recently the Obama administration stated to Federal Judge Katherine Forest that under (NDAA) The National Defense Authorization Act of 2012 the President had authorization to lock up belligerents indefinitely. That they (were justified) to lock belligerents up indefinitely—because cases involving belligerents directly-aligned with militants against the good of America—warrants such punishment.) Pres. Obama could use NDAA provisions to order U.S. Military Forces to round up without evidence, millions of Americans including Secessionists and Militias by alleging they are belligerents or a threat to National Security. Many observers believe Obama intends to extend NDAA to imprison U.S. Citizens in Indefinite Detention not involved with or associated with enemy forces.

    Hitler included similar provisions in his fascist (Discriminatory Decrees signed February 28, 1933). Almost immediately after the German Parliament passed Hitler’s laws, the Reich Government ordered the arrest of German Citizens and confiscated their guns without probable cause or evidence; delegated powers to German Police and other authorities to arrest anyone Nazi authorities claimed attempted or incited public unrest: arrested among others were outspoken Germans, writers, journalists, peaceful protestors and artists. After World War II the East German Secret Police (Stasi) used the threat of Indefinite Detention to forcibly recruit thousands of informants.

    The U.S. 2012 NDAA legislation Obama signed 12-31-11 is similar to Hitler’s 1933 fascist laws the SS and Gestapo used to target persons in Germany for arrest, imprisonment and execution without probable cause; and confiscate millions of dollars of property. Hitler used his laws to suspend Parliament and the Supreme Court insuring his laws could not be rescinded.

    During the Obama Administration’s recent request for a (stay) to stop U.S. District Judge Katherine Forrest blocking enforcement of vague NDAA provisions, the Obama Administration—never clarified what constitutes a (belligerent); or militant; or what belligerent activities (directly aligned with a militant) to order a belligerent’s arrest or indefinite detention; or what is against the good of America. Under vague provisions of NDAA, the President could accuse anyone of being (directly aligned with militants by way of any political or other association; activity, statement, writing or communication with an individual or group government deemed (militant) to arrest and indefinitely detain Americans. Writers, journalists, Americans that disagree with or question U.S. Government or its allies—may under NDAA be subject to arrest and indefinite detention.

    NDAA 2012, like Hitler’s 1933 Discriminatory Decrees enforces censorship; refers to the Patriot Act e.g. warrant-less searches of private property and forfeiture of property from persons not charged with crime. Provisions in NDAA 2012 keep the door open for corrupt U.S. police; government agents and provocateurs which there are many, to falsify reports and statements to target any American, group or organization for arrest, indefinite detention, complete disappearance; civil asset forfeiture of their property.

    You may have noted NDAA referred to the USA Patriot Act. The Patriot Act lends itself to Government / police corruption; the Federal Government may use secret witnesses and informants to cause arrests and civil asset forfeiture of Americans’ property. Witness(s) and informants may be paid up to 50% of assets forfeited. Federal Government under 18USC may use a mere preponderance of civil evidence, little more than hearsay to Civilly Forfeit Private Property. Under the Patriot Act innocent property owners may be barred by government knowing the evidence federal government uses to forfeit their property.

    Sections of NDAA 2012 are so broad, it appears U.S. Government or the President could (retroactively) deem an American’s past 1st Amendment activities prior to passage of 2012 NDAA—supported hostilities, terrorism or (Belligerents) to order the arrest and Indefinite Detention of any U.S. Citizen, writer, group or organization.

    Under NDAA 2012 it should be expected that indefinitely detained U.S. Citizens not involved in terrorism or hostile activities, not given Miranda Warnings when interrogated, not allowed legal counsel or habeas corpus may be prosecuted for non-terrorist (ordinary crimes) because of their (alleged admissions) while held in Indefinite Detention.

  6. Well, i guess you guys need something to bitch about or you won;t be happy. Just try to keep the stray bullets to a minimum or within the confines of whatever militia compoud or cult your form. If you need Nike’s for your journey I’ll put together a charity drive to supply as many as you need. A new comet sould be around shortly for you to hitch a ride on.

    • What a flippant response CCF. You came up with that all by your little self?

      Well, I have a flippant comment right … back … at … you … pal.

      If they need Nike’s, or anything else, I will fund them for oh how about the next 5-10 years … right out of my checking account. How’s that, pal?

      Aren’t I charitable. :)

      However, you can eat cake.

      • I did. I’ve been taking my meds and they make me very creative. . and a little euphoric. Nice of you to do that, but perhaps you should save some of that dough for the extra 2 or 3 % in taxes you’ll have to pay under “Obama Socialism.” It could wipe you out.

        • Like the rest of the rich folks, I have made my provisions … not that all of us “rich folks” can do anything about the national debt anyway (which you believed hook-line-and-sinker …. because Obama says so).

          How about you? Have you made your provisions for the upcoming tax hike?

          Oh pardon me, I forgot. You are a part of the Free Sh*t Army. I remember that from our little debate over on your site.

          Nevermind. :)

          Half-time over. Enjoy the rest of your game. Let’s see how many turnovers Chicago has this half while I finish off my Papa John’s pizza that you, and your sycophant friends are hyperventilating over today.

          • Nope. Haven’t heard about any papa johns controversy. (i have local fish to supply for my fryer these days) I like them when they are cheaper than Dominos.

            I get taxed pretty high and with my wife’s new job, now that we have both fled the state so we can actually support our family, expect to be taxed even higher. I believe in goverment services, which i pay taxes for. I pay much in taxes and i expect something in return other than enormous tax breaks for GE, Exxon, and BP (i know I got a free makever of the Gulf of Mexico into a sewer from BP for free, but that’s not the kind of free stuff I appreciate.)

            I wouldn’d mind the Romney deal where all my income gets taxed at the lower capital gains rate, but i don’t think that was fiscally responsible. That was too much free stuff in my opinion. In the face of debt that is equivalent to 56k for every man woman and child you were voting for a guy that was promisng to lower your taxes, dramatically increase military spending and thus drastically increase the debt.

            Talk about a free shit army! He was planning to do it literally!

  7. Whoever the addled-minded fool is that began this foolish notion of secession, do bear in mind that you do NOT speak for me. If you hate Obama so much, why don’t YOU, you troglodytic simpleton, secede from the United States of America? Florida does not have the finances to support itself as a sovereign nation. So why should a whole state, MY STATE, suffer, because you happen to have a Herculean hissy fit? I’m a proud American, and a proud Floridian. Your actions besmirch the pride of Florida as a whole, only appeasing the GOP puppets.

    • Actually AE, Florida is doing much better in the subject of finances than let’s say … the liberal state of California, Michigan, and others.

      And while you offer an apprentices level of hyperbole, just know that your post offering serves more to expose you as an intellectual pauper than it does to shed actual light on the fiscal situation of Florida. Granted, secession in and of itself is someone’s pipe dream, it does not mean you should gouge yourself intellectually, as spell checkers are only going to do so much.

      As a side bar: Florida’s position to refuse Federal money to fund healthcare under Obamacare will do more to ensure the survival of the state, than if they cave in and accept that meager offering from the feds, and the Chicago gangster that leads them.

      Count your blessings down there, while you still have them. The early predictions are that in a couple of years Crist may resurface, and if he manages to run, and get re-elected, you may end up having to find a new state to live in.

    • If you hate Obama so much, why don’t YOU, you troglodytic simpleton, secede from the United States of America?

      You folks on the Left sure like this word “troglodyte.” You do realize — given that your hero, Al Gore has advocated forcing us all to live in dirt huts with one government controlled light bulb — that it more accurately describes your reactionary policies than anything the Right espouses…don’t you? :-)

      Also, I do not know Obama, nor do most of us who oppose his policies. So how could we hate him? And why do you assume we are racist? You rightly point out that most of us are white, so how could we hate him based on race? He’s half white. Now, before you argue that he is half black and that this is why we hate him, let me try to save you from yourself. According to everything I have been told by you folks on the Left, to focus only on his black skin and deny his whiteness is…well, it would make YOU a racist. (sorry, YOU guys designed that catch 22, then you immediately proceed to jump in it with both feet. So, since the shoe fits you…)

      Florida does not have the finances to support itself as a sovereign nation.

      Actually, this is not true. We may not have the resources to be a WELFARE nation, but then, that’s the point of secession. Otherwise, farming, tourism and exploitation of fossil fuel resources would MORE than sustain an independent State.

      I mean, this should be evident — unless you are going to argue that no State in the union is self-sufficient, which would mean the union is not self-sufficient, which is actually an argument for secession in the name of self-preservation.

      So why should a whole state, MY STATE, suffer, because you happen to have a Herculean hissy fit?

      “Your” State is as much mine as yours, so where do you get off presuming to speak for the State at the same time you send Obama to rob us? We’re not having a “hissy fit,” we’re fighting to preserve our individual rights and liberties, and to defend ourselves from looters such as yourself.

      Your actions besmirch the pride of Florida as a whole, only appeasing the GOP puppets.

      I am NOT a Republican. As for the “Pride of Florida:” the area in which I live wants NOTHING to do with the policies you embrace. In fact, my part of the States has tried to secede from Florida and join Alabama twice — and almost succeeded the last time. Maybe you should try to understand this republican thing a bit better before you try to jam that one-size-fits-all mentality down the throats of the people paying for your utopian ideas.

      • <>You rightly point out that most of us are white, so how could we hate him based on race? He’s half white

        And of course no half-breeds have ever been discriminated against before? Your argument is not starting off so well.

        <>Maybe you should try to understand this republican thing a bit better before you try to jam that one-size-fits-all mentality down the throats of the people paying for your utopian ideas.

        Better than your dystopian and mypoic ones. :)

  8. Its about time. We did this in Colonial times. More states need to get on the band wagon. We must also protest by flying the American Flag upside down. I am looking for the petition but can’t find it. If its true that this will go on the WH Web Site, our names will forever be polaced on the FBI watch list…..If we are not already there. Think about it. We who sign continue what our foreFathers died for.

  9. I have a problem signing a petition to secede when there are word in the petition that are misspelled, e.g. “here buy” instead of “hereby.” This does not appear to be a serious movement or I would myself sign.

    • John,

      Understood, but then, you have to also understand this is being done by the people, themselves. As far as I am concerned, the effort will be stillborn unless and until it reaches a point where the STATES cannot afford to ignore it. That’s why I signed: because it can only help and cannot harm.

  10. I suggest that Atlas should shrug, go get his EBT card and Obamaphone head out to Colorado where he can smoke a joint while waiting in line for his Obamacare doctor to put him on permanent Social Security Disability after that he can head out to Washington State and marry his life partner Hercules where they can raise their eugenically created daughter Julia as a slave to government programs and assistance perpetuating the cycle of dependency.

  11. LOL Reading all these postall i can think is people should not have donated money to Romneys campiagn but diapers instead, that way he cold have passed them out to all the crybabies left behind i his wake. lol

      • Maybe so, CCF, but where do those blue states get their resources? Who’s really generating the revenue?

        Besides that, how to account for all those blue states with applications for secession? Serious question. I haven’t figured that one out yet.

        • Justin,

          I wrote about that: the empire-builders on the Left who rail against empire-builders. They just can’t see their empire, or that the “nations” they suppress and exploit are the red States.

          • “highly unlikely. Most of my state doesn’t pay federal taxes and most of our state budget comes straight out of federal funding.”

            You mean out of my pocket. The government does not create revenue. They either forcibly take it, or they counterfeit it. Try really hard, not to conflate the facts, CCF.

  12. Based on CCF’s assertions, I decided to go look at the fiscal year report for Louisiana. Interesting. They sure take care of their teachers, and state employees …

    “As disclosed in note 6 to the financial statements, the actuarial accrued liability for the Louisiana
    State Employees’ Retirement System and the Teachers’ Retirement System of Louisiana
    (Systems) is reported as $15,221,055,000 and $24,096,754,000, respectively, at June 30, 2011.”

    However, the state is doing pretty well considering it’s projections over the next year (2013) …

    “The assets of the State exceeded its liabilities at the close of the fiscal year by $15.6 billion”

    http://www.doa.louisiana.gov/osrap/library/Publications/cafr2011.pdf

    All is not as bad as CCF would have you believe.

    • Augger,

      That was some piss poor research for you, i must say.

      Teachers and state employees get treated pretty bad. State employees haven;t had raises for the last 4 years. My wife and i both went back to the private sector because our salaries were going down as inflation went up and costs of various insuance programs went up.

      As or the retirement system deficits, that’s caused by the state not making its contributions. Employees were required to make contirbutions – they don’t pay into Social Security so do not get any benefits from them when they retire -however the state hasn’t been making its contirbution for the past 20-30 years and has been doling out beneifts to part time legislators and other appointed public officals who just paid into the system for a few years. State workers make much less than private sector counterparts (believe me, we both transferred and my wife doubled her salary and i didnt doo bad myself and took a position that would have been the equivalent of someone who my assistants would have supervised.), but were promised nice pensions to compensate (in theory) The state got its years of service and paid us less, much less than private sector equivalents, and is now defaulting massively on its obligations. But that’s the kind of stuff you guys like to see. People working much of their lives and then having it taken away by politicians because they decide after the fact and the years of service they can’t afford it. (Even though they could have and still can if they chose to pay for what they used and what they promised)

      Louisiana only takes in around 8-10 billion or less in income, corporate and sales taxes. Our budget is around 26-30 billion depending on storm aid and the like.

      • “That was some piss poor research for you, i must say.”

        Take it up with your state government. It’s their document, and their quotes. Although … maybe it’s a scandal that Susan Rice was in on? :D

        • It might be yours in 4 years. Jindal has his sights on the prize. He’s quite a scary, fascist monster, so I’m sure you’ll love him. When he lies to you and robs you blind, like he has Louisiana, you might start thinking Democrats aren’t all that bad. Many of the Republican’s I’m working with now hate his guts, but are afraid of him because he’s so ruthless, evil, cruel and corrupt.

          Sounds like your kinda guy.

          • Oh, I see. So that report is like this Benghazi mess … one big ass conspiracy. Got it.

            And your ad hominem attack was just special. You don’t like your state, or your Governor, so pick on the guy that references their document as a source. Would Huffington Post have been more suited to your socialist palate?

            • Your reference to the pension system was irrelevant, just like most of the Benghazi criticism.

              Jindal is looking to be your President. He he looking for your vote in 2016. He won’t be getting mine.

              • You are irrelevant CCF. The simple truth is, Jindal is your Governor, and you simply do not like him. You want to attack a conservative movement, or a conservative American with use of Jindal, then so be it. But in all honesty … if you have an issue with Jindal, be man enough to take that issue up with him … tough guy.

                So Jindal is looking to be my personal President huh? Is he the only person out there looking to be “my” president? Hell, even if he is … how in the hell can he be any worse than the one I already have?

                Have a little advice for you, pal. Rush off and buy some Twinkies. It may be the last you see for awhile. Your Free Sh*t Socialist Army saw to that, and while you are at it, better go get your geri-chair now. Looks like Stryker is about to crumple too … thanks to “YOUR” policies of lunacy.

                Have a nice day, and tell Spock I said hello. :)

                • You can chase us off one by one, like you did Melfamy, and pretend we don’t exist; even close your eyes and tell us we’re invisible, like a small child, but that doesn’t make us go away. It’s sad that you have reverted to your old, incoherent ways, Augger, but i suppose I did twist your tail a bit so i feel a little responsbile. Sadly you will be just as bewildered and disappointed at the next presidential election if this isolation keeps up, but i suppose you have 4 years to get over it. I will let you get started.

                  Look me up if you ever feel like having a seriousish discussion (I don’t mind occasional offhanded insult and generic partisan jab, but not the piss poor reasoning skills and personal attacks you’ve stooped to bringing to bear recently. That’s just sad.)

                  Later guys. Enjoy your seceeding. I’m sure that will work out well for you.

  13. You all sound like whining crybabies, sure punish the whole state and your country over your sour grapes. I don’t agree with Obama or support him but I support the well being of the union. Any state seceding would further weaken the country and by far more then anything Obama could screw up in the next 4 years. Turn off fox news and learn whats really going on and educate your neighbors rather then regurgitate what you hear from left or right wing propaganda machines. If you love your country and call yourself an American then show some pride and dignity and fix whats wrong rather then abandoning it.

    • ===Turn off fox news and learn whats really going on and educate your neighbors rather then regurgitate what you hear from left or right wing propaganda machines.===

      Brian,

      If we did as you suggest, we would not know about Benghazi, Fast & Furious, the DOJ protecting the NBP, the voter fraud, the fraud in Obamacare: we wouldn’t know anything about how corrupt Obama and the people around him are. Now, I suspect you think all of this is just the result of the Right making false accusations, but it isn’t and we can look to the Left’s attacks on Bush to prove it. Whether the Right likes it or not, there was a great deal of truth in the attacks the Left levied on Bush, just as there is a great deal of truth in the attacks on Obama. To think Bush was 100% crooked and Obama 100% innocent is to believe in fairy tales.

      I would suggest YOU need to turn off Pravda West and start watching FOX and listening to conservative talk radio. They are not 100% correct all the time, but they actually “try” to rest their positions in sound reasoning. This cannot be said about the Left. THERE IS NO MIDDLE IN THIS NATION ANYMORE, that’s just something the Left says when they no longer want to be associated with the Left.

  14. You would suspect wrong. There is a reason why they call it spin, all left and right media tries to use at least a little truth and then color the hell out of it and misrepresent it to suit there needs and in some cases the little nugget of truth is almost impossible to find and that’s why I advocate not wasting your time watching/listening to it. I for one rely on the internet for information and if something smells of BS I read multiple articles on it to attain what I believe to be true and try to find the least biased sources. Obama is far from innocent, I never claimed him to be and Bush is now irrelevant since he is no longer in office.

    There is a middle and always will be one, our voices are just muffled by the cries of the overwhelming majority of the far left and far right. In my opinion the right wing media spins far too much (fox news) and I don’t find them credible (not that the left wing media is much better). I refuse to believe we as a people lost the ability to make an informed decision on our own but more and more I just hear word for word verbatim from either the left or right propaganda bullet points of what they believe are the most important issues. I for one would love to see an upset where a 3rd party candidate wins and teaches both the left and right some humility and maybe remember that there job isn’t to secure a D win or an R win but to serve the American people.

    I’m not saying get behind Obama or support him or hell, even like him, I sure don’t, but what I am saying is talk of secession over losing the election is ridiculous and seems childish. It was ridiculous and childish when the left cried the same thing in 2000 over Bush winning. It reminds me of an 8 yo who takes his toys and goes home because he didn’t get his way. Be careful of what you wish for If it were to come true and multiple states secede it would mark the downfall of a great nation to which recovery may be impossible. I’m not ready to give up on America, I am a patriot. I know our country has flaws but we can work on fixing them. The next 4 years will be tough but the majority of Americans got what they asked for and as an American and a patriot I will respect there decision although whole heartily disagree with it.

    For the record I have no idea what “Pravda West” is, is it a TV show, radio show. If its another spin media show for either side it’s probably not worth my time to find out.

    • Brian,

      If you honestly believe that the reaction to Obama is simply about losing an election, then you do not understand the issue at hand. It is not about liking or disliking Obama, about the color of his skin or even his policies: it is about the fact that he is an openly declared subversive. In case you do not know U.S. Code, that is an illegal and impeachable act. A popular election cannot and should not be allowed to “over rule” US law, and if it is allowed because people like you refuse to face the reality of what people like myself are reacting to, then that is yet another reason to secede: to preserve our liberty.

      The issue is the preservation of the national ideal — and that ideal is individual rights and liberty. That ideal does not need all 50 States to survive and, if too many of the blue States are allowed into the body of the whole, then ALL 50 will die to tyranny.

      As for Pravda West — that is how I refer to people calling themselves “the main stream media:” because they are little different from the original Pravda. They are nothing more than the propaganda organ of the American political Left.

    • Brain, when I read your remarks, I get the feeling that you are up on things, and really understand whats going on, then I read your question about Pravda and I get a thought to the contrary. How can this person be up on things, and not know that Pravda is the government owned and controlled newspaper of Russia, making me think that you are not really sincere in what you posted, but instead spewing BS. Please convince me that I must be wrong.

      • I know what Pravda is but for some reason Pravda West didn’t click as I was not thinking of Russian newspapers when I read that line, but I get the reference now,

  15. We must seperate our selves from all the socialist idiots, and uphold the constitution and laws they way they were originally written.

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