OK, I confess: I fell for Fiorina — and for the same reasons I believe most people are falling for Trump. I like what Trump says, and I admit, I am even a little sympathetic to the way he says it, but I know he is most likely a Democrat Party infiltrator sent to work in much the same way as Ross Perot did. Trump is a RINO, and he definitely is not a ‘conservative,’ so, while others may support him, I am too leery of him to support him — even if he happens to be telling the truth (which I doubt). So, when I saw Carly Fiorina sounding off much the same way Trump does, I thought I might have found a candidate I could get behind. WRONG! I found some things that cause me great concern. If what I found is correct — and it appears to be — it would mean that Carly is little more than a female Trump.
The warning buzzers started to go off in my head when I saw this story:
Carly Fiorina Attacks Cruz: ‘No Honor’ in Fight to Defund Obamacare
“There’s no honor in charging a hill that you know you can’t take, only casualties, although Ted Cruz maybe got name recognition and money along the way,”
As a former Marine, let me say this as clearly as I can:
Ms Fiorina, you don’t know the first damn thing about honor!
If you are sent to take a hill you cannot take, and ordered to take it anyway, you do it. You do it for nothing other than the fact that this is what you signed on to do when you raised your hand and took your oath to defend this nation. And a great many men have died for this nation charging hills that could not be taken. If this… ‘woman’ need an example, I’ll give her one — Sugar Loaf Hill!
Nine times the Marines were ordered to take that hill, and nine times they were slaughtered. Yet, every time after the first, when the order was given, they went — knowing they would most likely die. This was after the Army had been spent trying to take the same hill. This battle has become part of the legend that is the U.S. Marine Corps, and it is exactly way honor is all about — and how it is won: doing what you know cannot be done simply because it is your duty to do so.
Senator Cruz was elected — in large part — on the promise to end Obamacare, and that is what he has repeatedly tried to do. So Cruz has honor — because he is trying to keep his word. But, apparently, Carly would have us believe that it is ‘acceptable’ to go into her boardroom as a CEO and do whatever is most expedient — even if it is not what the stock holders vote for the company to do. After all, if they vote for something she decides cannot be done, then she seems to think there would be no honor in doing her job and that she should just…not do her job.
This is enough to kill her as a candidate in my eyes, and it should be in the eyes of any serious American, as well. But then I found this, and it caused me to move her into the same category as I place Obama — traitor!
There was once a civilization that was the greatest in the world…
While modern Western civilization shares many of these traits, the civilization I’m talking about was the Islamic world from the year 800 to 1600, which included the Ottoman Empire and the courts of Baghdad, Damascus and Cairo, and enlightened rulers like Suleiman the Magnificent.
Although we are often unaware of our indebtedness to this other civilization, its gifts are very much a part of our heritage. The technology industry would not exist without the contributions of Arab mathematicians. Sufi poet-philosophers like Rumi challenged our notions of self and truth. Leaders like Suleiman contributed to our notions of tolerance and civic leadership.
Yes, you read this correctly: this woman seems to think the Caliphate was a greater civilization than the Western world, or even America. I did not think this could be correct, but then, the story links to the transcript of the original speech. It appears that she actually said those words.
You may agree with her, but I have taken the time to study the truth about the Caliphate. There was nothing ‘great’ about the Muslim world. In fact, it was the epitome of everything the ‘PC’ Left tells us we are supposed to be against: slave-owning, racist, womanizing, intolerant thieves who steal from whomever they can to make themselves rich. Yes, they were good at arithmetic, but that went back to a time long before Islam. Islam gets no credit for that part of their heritage. Neither can they claim great artists or musicians — because Muhammad outlawed pictures and music. There ethics were based on Shari’a law, and they do not hold up to anything the civilized world would recognize as ‘good.’ The truth is, the Caliphate was barbaric and backward and had no chance of ‘evolving’ out of the 7th Century. If it had not been for the discovery of oil by Western nations, the Islamic world would still be in the 7th Century today. So I do not know what this woman was thinking about, but it must have been based on some alternate universe because the history of the Caliphate in this world has no resemblance tot he one she described in her speech.
But this is exactly the point: if she thinks the greatest civilization in history was the Islamic Caliphate, then I do not want this woman anywhere near an elected office of any type. Islam and the ideal of a constitutional republic based on individual rights and liberty cannot be reconciled. they are ideas that are eternally at war with each other, and the fact that she favors Islam over America is all I need to know to say she is no different than the Muslim we have in the White House now. So, speaking only for myself, I have scratched her from my list and placed her on the growing list of traitors to their country.
ADDENDUM
Do not skim over Fiorina’s words about Islam. She is doing more than just trumpeting the contributions of Islam to the modern world, she is actually helping to perpetuate a modern myth. I have been looking into this, tracing it to its origins, and it is recent (last decade or so). Before this, you will not find the glowing accolades for Medevil Islam that are so prominent today. Our PC world is largely to blame for this. What careful study will reveal is the growing realization that Islam — the same culture Fiorina is praising — was most likely the cause for the Dark Ages. This is closer tot he truth than anything Carly is saying, and a Presidential candidate in a time when we will be fighting Islam had damned well better know this:
The Impact of Islam on Medieval Europe
The impact of Islam on Europe was twofold: economic and cultural. As long ago as the 1930s, Belgian medievalist Henri Pirenne demonstrated that it was Islam, with its blockade of the Mediterranean, which had definitively terminated Classical Civilization. With the ending of trading links between Europe and the Eastern Mediterranean, the great cities of the West, in Gaul, Spain, and Italy, which depended on that trade, began to die. This marked the disappearance of the urban civilization of Antiquity. The West became impoverished, and the termination of the supply of papyrus from Egypt meant a return very quickly to almost pre-Roman levels of illiteracy.
Read the link. It is closer to the truth than most anything else available today — that goes double for the story Carly gives in this speech.
The Rio Norte Line 
A careful reading indicates she disagreed with Cruz on tactics, not substance. She also correctly attributed the government shutdown to Obama. She also spoke of Islamic civilization in the past tense. It WAS a great civilization – the fact is we use mathematics concepts developed by Islamic scholars today as well as using Arabic numerals and symbols is an indicator of how influential it once was. Islamic civilization reached it’s zenith in the 1200-1300’s when Europe was surviving the Dark Ages and was finally broken at the Gates of Vienna in 1683. I don’t think she is promoting it.
That is not what she said. ‘A careful reading’ seems to me to be a nice way to rationalize defending her.
Her comments about Cruz were meant exactly as she put them: she does not think there was any honor in Cruz keeping his word to his voters. that alone tells me we should not trust her any more than Trump.
Her comments on Islam were to praise it as ‘The Greatest Society in History.’ She did not mean the largest, she said it was better than any other — including America. She even said the West owes things to the Caliphate. it does not. The West did not come from Islamic tradition; it came from the Judeo/Christian tradition. These two cultures are forever at odds with each other. They cannot co-exist — period. And she put Islam over the West in her speech, and that is very clear.
I cannot and will not support someone who says such things. In my book, that places her side-by-side with Obama in regards to Islam, and that makes her an enemy of this Nation’s people.
Sure, Joe. Never has been a great civilization other than ours today…
From your own link to what she said, and this is her direct quote: “There was once a civilization that was the greatest in the world.”
The word “once” puts the comment in context. She never praised it as you quoted.
I would think as a military man, you would agree that getting your men killed on a hill you know you cannot take truly does lack honor, especially when you have no expectation of reinforcements.
“I would think as a military man, you would agree that getting your men killed on a hill you know you cannot take truly does lack honor, especially when you have no expectation of reinforcements.”
Spoken like a man who has never worn the uniform in harms way…
I guess you didn’t read my post? You couldn’t have, because I bloody-well addressed this one head on. I’ll tell you where there is no honor: in not trying because you have already decided it cannot be done. THAT’S where there is no honor — in Fiorina’s position, not Cruz’s.
And I don’t think you bothered to read her full statement on Islam, either, because it is based on a misrepresentation of fact:
Thanks for the unnecessary lecture.
I’m sure that only you know the real truth and history of Islam even though you are the one who made the point that it only went dark with the discovery of oil in the Middle East. I would argue that radicalism started with the Muslim Brotherhood and Hassan al Banna in 1928 when they started pushing back against British rule.
Fiorina is actually accurate – there were some important Islamic philosophers and scientists – but I know that doesn’t mean much to someone convinced otherwise.
Now I remember why I stopped commenting on posts on my own blog.
I said that Islam was a wasteland until AFTER the discovery of oil. Had it not been for that, save for Israel, that part of the world would still be in the 7th Century.
Islam has been ‘radical’ since day 1, but you are in that camp who thinks you have the authority to speak for Muhammad — after the fact. You may not like it, and you can continue to think I am wrong, but I have documented where Muhammad ordained Jihad until there is only Islam many times. I am NOT wrong. I read the books and took time to make sure I understood MUHAMMAD’s words properly, as HE meant them.
And I do not disagree that there were some Islamic philosophers and mathematicians who did good work. But then, what I actually say never slows you down when you disagree. To equate a few contributors to a ‘civilization that helped build the modern Western world’ is to distort reality to the point of a lie. I provided scholarly support for my position. I can provide more — dating back to BEFORE the PC attempt to re-write history so as to attack the West (something you usually oppose) and appease Islam). Many of the very people getting credit for the advances in question were actually Westerners living under Islamic rule who did so to gain access to the information Islam had sealed up after their conquests of the Eastern Roman Empire. But I guess it is to Islams credit if slaves actually made the advances, huh?
Utah, you can support Carly. I get it: you see her as a CEO peer. You think you play chess with politics. I understand. But what I see that you do not is that you are not helping the situation by perpetuating the thinking and tactics that caused and keep us in the position we’re in. Keep defending people who send out warning signs like this and you’ll keep getting RINOs who advance the Progressive cause.
BTW: you know how you take the un-takable hill? You keep going up the damned thing until you finally take it or everyone on your side is dead. That way, you either win, or it doesn’t bloody matter anymore. But you do not run away from the fight and tell yourself you’re living to fight another day — because the next day, all you will do is run away again and tell yourself the same lie all over again.
Wow I’m glad you put up her entire speech/comment. It’s important to have information.
Her talking about : ” and its military protection allowed a degree of peace and prosperity that had never been known “.
It’s like she completely forgot about the Pax Romana or something.
Don,
I always put up the information, it’s just that too few of us bother to read a post, let alone the links in it (and yes, I can be as guilty of this as anyone else).
However, in this case, I did it to show that she was trying to make more of the Caliphate than it deserves. That alone disqualifies her for President and places her in the same category as all the others out there who apologize for Islam. You cannot support Islam AND the U.S. Constitution — period! The two systems simply cannot co-exist.
I ALWAYS read through and links….. it’s “who I am” …. ;- )).
I meant that put her words up in entirety in the Body of your Comment….outside of a link. People don’t always click the link but they will read through if it’s there in front of them.
Don,
Double-edged sword. I am naturally inclined to do as you suggest, but as you have pointed out, the younger generation will simply type ‘tltr’ and move on (too long to read). Kells is the perfect example: how many times has she complained that my posts are too long?
So I try to cite what I felt are the most important parts and it STILL doesn’t work.
In the end: a person will learn and understand only if they want to do so. So I write to those people because — if we’re perfectly honest — that is the only group who is even willing to consider changing their minds. the rest will just defend their tribe no matter how much evidence we present. Don, you know I’m right on this one (I know because I used to be ‘tribal,’ myself).
No No. I think it DID work.
And my comment wasn’t meant NOT as general way to go forward….but rather specific to this Post and Comment section…..that it DID work in the Context of your major Points.
In other words it was a well chosen time and place to put this particular full quote !
ah, OK. My apologies: I misunderstood.
Hey Joe and or Utah !
Have you ever read Henri Pirenne ?? I haven’t seen his name in ages, but I had to read in School ! Now that brings back memories….. tough reading but I kind of liked it !
No, but now that you mention him, I might add him to my lost of things I need to read. 😉
“your LOST of things you need to read” ???
So we are alike…. I also have LOST many things I meant to read before I read them….. :- ))
lol, yep. OK, list of things
Ok for you …. but I still have my Lost List of things that I meant to read. With no solution in sight.
LOL, I expect we could easily get drunk if we had a shot contest over our reading lists. Too bad more people out there don’t have equally long and RELEVANT lists, themselves 🙂
I don’t drink anymore….. Chhelo told me not to on another Post recently….. ;- ))
But you don’t drink any less, either — right? 😉
BINGO on your any more any less comment !! PERFECT !
Youse is a Henny Youngman at Heart … :- ))
This is something I know a little about doing some graduate history work on just this subject. During the widest extent of the Caliphate 1200-about 1430.
The claim about Arabic mathematics is incorrectly described by many, including Carly. Very little was developed by muslims. Rather they acted more as aggregators of others Ideas. The Greeks, Babylonians, Egyptians and Vedic Indians. We do use arabic numerals….but even there some of them were taken from Indian, Greek and Egyptian/Phoenician usage. The concept of zero for instance ( without which higher algebra would be impossible) is Vedic/Hindu. And algebra itself has its antecedents in Egypt and Babylon.
The muslims put it together in a book in about the 800s. There were some extensions to the basic understanding done by Arab scholars like the poet Khayyam, but the momentum shifted from the 1200s to the 1500s with the Italians, and thence to the scientific Revolution in the west. muslim influence, except as preservers of the knowledge, was minimal.
islam was influential, absolutely. But for all the different reasons which you and Joe and others have talked about here. It was Political Correctness that inspired Carly to Claim any different……one would assume she knows the Truth, being the CEO of a major Technology company.
Just because she is a CEO of a big company, do not ‘assume’ she knows the truth. A sad lesson I have learned in recent years is that many of these PC-idiots actually believe their own lies.
And sometimes believe Others lies too unfortunately …. :- ((.
I tell you, B., I did not get to hear Fiorina or the boys from the first debate. My mom really liked her….holy crap…..that may scare folks more than Trump! (she’s a Sally, after all…jes sayin…)
I liked her ! She did an excellent job in the debate. I fully expect to see her on the next one next to Cruz and Trump and Paul !
Well not next to….but on the same stage.
Carly is VERY GOOD taking on Hillary. She is consistent and Correct about what she says….and is increasing her attack and getting more exposure. All of that is very positive !!
Of Concern are these issues:
She is FOR Cap and Trade.
She is FOR an internet sales Tax ( gov’t regulation)
She is/was FOR TARP.
She has been a muslim sympathizer.
Don,
Thanks for your post at 04:10, you stated my words. Islam destroyed more History/Civilization than any
other dominating entity in history up to our current era. One of the most tragic in my opinion is the
Museum of Alexandria in Egypt that the Islamic Terrorist of his time (Saladin?), destroyed and burned
inventions and written ideas that we are now recovering and understanding.
You have the “Politically Correct” Carly identified for 2001. That was “then,” this is “today.”
Ronald Reagan and I were both democrats in the early years. That was “then,” this is “today.”
EdwardS
Denada Edward. I always enjoy your comments.
Unless they can show a CLEAR point at which they changed, and exp[lain what it was that caused that change, the only thing that has really ‘changed’ is their status as a candidate for office (in other words, nothing has changed except their need to be seen as having changed).
Did I change-up the way I used change in that post enough for you? 🙂
Joe,
So if that is the reason for their change–whut is the problem?
EdwardS
That is the problem: most these people cannot give you a reason for their change other than “I need to trick you into voting for me — wink-wink”
Joe,
That is an excellent reason to raise the voting age to 25!
Too many 18 year olds with 7 year old mentality voting. The only time I like a large voter turn-out
is when the final count is close. That’s when the democrats really cheat.
“I need to trick you into voting for me — wink-wink?” Henny Youngman humor?
EdwardS